36. Couples Retreat - With Tamika Carlton

Is your relationship stuck on repeat? If you’ve ever felt emotionally disconnected, like you’re the only one trying, or unsure if your partner even sees the effort you make, this episode is for you. Many betrayed partners feel isolated in their pain, carrying the weight of the relationship on their own. But real connection isn’t out of reach. It’s just waiting to be rediscovered.

In this heartfelt conversation with relationship coach and retreat host Tamika Carlton, we explore the transformative power of intentional space. Whether you’re recovering from infidelity, stuck in emotional detachment, or longing for genuine connection, this episode offers real hope and practical perspective.

Key Takeaways:

• Connection needs space. Learn why changing your environment often sparks emotional breakthroughs.

• Couples don’t need to be “broken” to grow. Retreats are not just for recovery, they’re for rediscovery.

• Stop waiting for your partner to change. Insightful relationships start with your own clarity and intention.

• Validation matters. The smallest unseen efforts often create the biggest emotional disconnects.

• True growth isn’t always comfortable. Real love asks us to communicate, listen, and show up differently.

💬 Reflection questions:

Have you ever hoped a big decision, like marriage or a baby, would fix your relationship? What if creating space for deeper conversations was the real answer?

Connect with Luke:

• Website: www.lifecoachluke.com

• Instagram: @mylifecoachluke

• Email: luke@lifecoachluke.com

Join the After the Affair community at www.facebook.com/groups/aftertheaffaircommunity

Episode Transcript:

The After The Affair podcast with me Luke Shillings is here to help you process, decide and move forward on purpose following infidelity. Together we'll explore what's required to rebuild trust not only in yourself but also with others. Whether you stay or leave I can help and no matter what your story there will be something here for you.

Let's go. Hello and welcome to the After The Affair podcast episode number 36 with myself Luke Shillings. This week I'm being joined by Tameka Carlton.

Tameka is a relationship coach and avid traveller who believes in the power of forging meaningful connections. She's the creator of an inclusive relationship company Couples Experience that hosts luxury couples retreats. She has been featured on the Oprah Winfrey Show, Authority magazine, Her Forward and other high-profile media outlets.

With couples her goal is to create a space of comfort and transparency so they can share their stories and recognise their love. Massive shifts have come from her kind-hearted yet direct communication method and I can't wait to find out much more in today's conversation. So let's jump straight into it.

Okay Tameka thank you for joining us today on the After The Affair podcast. I've been really looking forward to talking to you. So from what I understand you are a relationship coach but you also specialise in couples retreats and bringing people together at various stages of their relationship.

I'll definitely be interested to talk as to what stage the majority of the people do tend to take that journey. Is it always after there's been problems within the relationship or is it something that people would try and approach proactively let's say. So if you'd like to if you'd like to introduce yourself and yeah of course.

Yeah works for me I'm Tameka Carlton I am a relationship coach and CEO and founder of Couples Experience which is an inclusive relationship company that hosts couples retreats in several different areas internationally and in the States. And then we also have tonnes of just really just relationship resources because ultimately one of the main reasons why I founded Couples Experience was because when my husband and I got together in 2016 it was like we were going through our issues and a lot of times people think oh it's a fresh relationship it's all this amazingness going on but we were having like real situations that people probably would have been surprised to know about and a lot of it was it was like who do you communicate and connect with right how do you connect about these relationship struggles that you're having without having like the shame and all of those things and you know one of the things that I suggested and my husband and I had a conversation and I was like we need to create that space right we need to create that space where people feel like they can be transparent and open about their relationship issues their relationship highs and lows and really grow from that and over time you know one of the main priorities for me too was just doing a lot of research and data analysis especially coming from a marketing background that was like all my thing but really just understanding that relationships is how we reach happiness and surprisingly in the States there's only 14% of people that report being happy and now I'm on a true mission to ensure that we increase that stat and just really focus on having quality relationships so yeah that's a little long-winded version of what I do so what do you think it is that would define happiness in a relationship that is a great question I think it's comfortability and contentment and knowing that you can be who you truly are in a relationship you know over time being a relationship coach and just surrounding myself with a diverse array of relationships and individuals a lot of people just are not happy because they feel like they're hiding so many things from their partner right and I think the main way to get to a sustainable state of happiness whether it's through couples relationships friendships you know business partnerships whatever it is it's when you really are able to bring your full self to the situation and that's what the couples retreats are all about and just couples experience as a whole is is you know encouraging people to be open to who they are and sharing that and all of the things that they want to present and figuring out if that relationship is fitting for that some of the things I see quite often with my own clients and the people I work with is that the traits of people-pleasing yes there's this nature in which where one person is trying to you know meet the needs of the other but they're usually through their own expectations and not the other person's expectations anyway and then of course this is also happening on the other side so you have these two people living these like almost artificial lives of what they believe the other person wants and vice versa and then ultimately actually being victims themselves and not even the other partner just by the way they're interpreting it so when somebody comes to you and they're at this point in their relationship where things maybe communication hasn't been great or there's there's been some awareness I mean actually first to that's actually so but what are the common stages in which people are coming on the retreats and coming to you yeah I would say from a retreat perspective it's more people that are either really happy or feeling really happy in the relationship and they're like we just want to experience more and experience fresh new things to continue to to to break down more barriers in the relationship so there's like the fresh loving like we're hyped up in the relationship and then you know there's a really good smaller percentage that is not even a smaller percentage just about 30% people that come to the retreats are struggling right and they either someone has cheated or they're just at this standstill where they feel like their relationship has become really stagnant and they're just not pleased right and so it really varies and I like to put people together that are in different phases of their relationship because a lot of time that's that's how enlightenment occurs and people kind of see themselves at a different phase and all of those things and it works together to get people to a different space. So how would a couple know I'm thinking back to probably some earlier stages in my life and like friends that I've seen in other people's relationships where maybe the relationship hasn't been going perfectly maybe they've been together a few years and then there's this these these common societal solutions of let's get married that'll fix it.

Let's have a baby you can't even divorce from a baby you know. That's not gonna do it okay. Exactly and I'm just thinking like from the perspective of let's say they were somebody a couple were looking to try and solve some problem that you know and they were thinking of things like marriage and children and or maybe they've even had all those things and they're looking for the next thing.

My gut is saying that that wouldn't be an opportunity the perfect time to be coming on something like this or would you disagree? I mean listen it's no I disagree only because you know I think the best part about the retreats and just being in relationship in general is whenever one party feels like there's something there they may not be able to articulate what that is yet. Whenever there is a feeling of I'm just not a hundred percent right. I'm not a hundred percent invested in this relationship.

I'm not a hundred percent feeling comfortable in this relationship. Whatever it is like that is the perfect time to go on a retreat right because whatever you're experiencing it's going to like build up continuously in your own life and a retreat is just going to almost force it to come up in a space where you can be nurtured and you can be kind of coached in the moment and progress to whatever state you need to get to so. Okay yeah now I can understand that and I can I can see how that that can work because I suppose unlike the scenarios I was describing before you're doing that independently still within the enclosed minds of the two people within that relationship.

There's no external factors at play in terms of guidance and and safe spaces and boundaries. Sure and I think sometimes and not to cut you off but sometimes I always think a lot of couples are in this phase at home and this goes for individuals as a whole too. Like just recently like I was like trying to think of a new business idea and I got stuck because you're in the same situation on a daily basis and I removed myself from you know my daily routine and then I was re-inspired and I think a lot of times when you're in a relationship that's the same thing.

You're in this daily routine that sometimes becomes very monotonous and you just can't see the possibilities right but when you're outside of whether it's your comfort zone or whether it's just in a different experience something is able to be shifted and you know with the retreats for us you can either do individual coaching you don't have to do coaching you can do couples coaching and or you can just have really good solid conversations with the couples on the retreat and I think a lot of times a lot of breakthroughs happen through that because another thing like I said at the beginning of the conversation is just that you know being in a relationship you're not most people don't have conversations about what they're thinking or experiencing whether it's with their partner or their friends or their family whomever and a lot of times when you do it you're getting judged right like people are like well you know someone always has their own insight or advisement and in this space and just hopefully in multiple other spaces you know you are in a place where you can tell your story people will listen and people will relate right and they will just be and a lot of times they'll share insights but it seems more valuable when it's coming from people that are in the same predicament or just investing in their relationship as a whole by going to this couples retreat right so yeah yeah I have quite a few people reach out to me and even the the clients I work with my clients one-to-one and I sometimes work with the betrayed sometimes the unfaithful male and female um but I do often get requests for couples like as in like and but often when we usually have a conversation at that point and that conversation usually comes to a point where we're we're trying to clarify what are the motivations behind wanting sure the partner to come in and certainly at this this stage in all of those conversations that I've had it's always ended up being that well if my partner does the work then that will raise the problem right and of course you know I'm coaching people one-to-one and so freeing them of that you know expectation for the other person to show up in a specific way for things to be okay so you have much more experience than me with the the couples type scenario it should be interesting to see how whether you've seen those kind of patterns and oh yeah where that diverges and how how you overcome those things yeah I think more than it as you stated like a lot of times it's easy to blame or it's easy to say that you know there's always an if factor there like if only or I wish that they would do or whatever and a lot of it is one why is you know having the conversations with two people is what is it that why is it that you need those things number one figuring out that because a lot of times it has nothing to do with the other person why you need those things and that discovery alone can help people to have a understanding of why they feel that way and have the other partner will have a better understanding to at least have some type of empathy if you're in that predicament in that place where you can feel the empathy sometimes you're bypass that you know what I mean but a lot of times it really is just clearly breaking down the why and the intention behind every action that is needed or required and I think more than anything when you come together as a couple in couples coaching it is more about having a third party that can kind of you know filter through the thoughts of course and then really kind of allow both individuals to have their moment to shine and speak and express because realistically when you're in a place even if you're in a decent place in a relationship sometimes you're just not hearing one another you know or you're hearing one another in the way that you are you typically receive information you're not totally listening and absorbing so I think that you know just being able to read back or disclose back what you're listening or what you hear is very valuable in those situations too do you find people often seeking validation oh for sure and I think you know naturally as humans that's what we need right that's that is just a necessity of who we are and a lot of times it's the simplest of validation like but haven't you noticed that I've been taking the trash out like and it's like those small things are easily ignored and easily forgotten and those are the things that really matter the most to people you know and those are the thing and a lot of times once again like the love languages you mentioned just how people love or receive things in their way versus how the other person needs to perceive or receive it it's just so so interesting always to see how the smallest of things that small appreciation or showing the smallest of appreciation for the smallest of things go a very very long way it's so true and I think even just things like activities like taking the trash out and you know it seems so innocent so harmless you don't really think about it in the context of a relationship unless you're a relationship coach and it's an analogy that comes up quite often of course but the the point being that if you're at a point in your relationship where you're seeing your partner in a particular way it's almost like you you have I'll often describe it as having a filter on yes almost like a shaded pair of glasses and it means that everything appears with that tint of green or blue or whatever it is that they're looking at so it doesn't really matter what they do or how they do it it's already pre-judged as being or prefaced prefaced as being wrong or you know and it doesn't matter how you know so if even if they do take the trash out they're not doing it right yeah exactly it's it's like a no-win situation it really is however however being able to shift that and it doesn't take much no when you focus on the positive side and all of a sudden you start filling that I often describe it as you know having like a a pot of which you can fill with evidence yes of things to support the good things that your partner's doing and the connection and the trust and all of the things and actually it doesn't take that long when you start looking no those things but it's like when you're in a place where you are not paying attention to those things and you are the other part the other person knows that you're not paying attention to those things those small things can cause such a degree of deterioration in a relationship that just can last for a long time obviously and those are the things that you know it's not always the cause for breakups or affairs or whatever but those are some of the key elements that drive people to you know away from one another it drives massive wedges between people and I think that you know it's it's almost like we're it's so easy to get engrossed in our daily lives of like these other things that we have to invest our time in and the most valuable times are those little moments that people are putting investments in the other person because even with me like you know being in a marriage and you know we all make mistakes and I'm sometimes I'm not paying attention either and it's like you know what I mean like I'm not gonna lie to you like I'm not perfect and a lot of times it is the smallest things like my husband will be like but did you see this though and I'm like well no like but once someone kind of calls it out and you're like okay because and a lot of times you're like but did you see that I did this for you you know yes you're like but I need the validation first before I give it to you my partner would be loving this right it's like it's like this is this is the key in relationships but you know it's one of those things that once I started really acknowledging those things I realised that those things were his way of showing his love too you know and that is how you you can't replace those things and I think that we just have to pay attention to the small things and acknowledge and appreciate and find the things that they are showing us they may be showing up for you in ways that you may not necessarily need and of course you have to cross that barrier of like love me the way that I need to be loved but it's also important to ensure that you recognise that the person is showing you love you know I couldn't agree more and that element of perfection you know um when when many people experience a desire for control yes by nature want to control things at least most people do and it's not uncommon to link a desire for control with perfectionism or at least I know certainly certainly something I've been guilty of throughout my life and even though I've been able to let a lot of that go and I've been able to approach things from a very different perspective and there is still that point where obviously you can't be perfect all the time right and when you start to but obviously I mean actually that is the point you can't be perfect now if at anything it's not even what even is perfect I suppose is probably the better question but when it comes to people are learning these skills they're learning to take responsibility for themselves they're learning to recognise and view their partner through a different lens let's say a different perspective and they get to a point where they almost it feels like they know what they should be doing now yes okay I know that I should be looking at from this perspective or maybe I should just be looking at from his point of view but then comes a point where just like you described and I'm definitely guilty of it you miss it and and it's not until you actually you know later on that evening and you're thinking oh yeah well yeah it's gone it's gone now and I think that's really important to recognise you know I live and breathe everything that we're talking about and I know you do too yes yes and we're both in relationships and we both still have all the same problems all the same thing yes difference the difference for me at least is that they don't compound over time anymore yes correct correct and that takes a lot of maturity emotional maturity and that does not happen overnight okay and I think that that's another thing like you have to have like I always tell people when I first got into this relationship like I've been in previous relationships obviously they never well not obviously but they did not get to marriage this got like we got married and I just remember early on in the relationship and one of the reasons why I got into relationship coaching by the way is I was the person that when we would get into an argument like I would just walk away like I don't want to talk to you I don't want this situation like I don't have time for this and it there was a point where Logan was like no you can't leave like you can't walk away and I was like oh yeah I can't but you see there was the the point is is that I had to grow from that that is not how you achieve a lasting positive fruitful relationship right and so there are moments where I'm like okay I still want to kind of walk away or get you know you get frustrated or whatever it may be but you in those moments you have to remember what is your intention for this relationship do you want this relationship to continue do you want it to be a fruitful relationship do you want to have your best friend in this situation do you want to continue to grow in your intimacy and if any of those questions are a yes and everyone has their own intention and you should be clear and what that is because in my world whatever you intend you will create and if whatever your intention is you have to acknowledge it in that moment and go into yourself and say I can't act like I used to act basically and you know I that's what we do all the time and that's what I tell clients all the time it's like you will consistently grow and evolve in this relationship and you have to figure out how you can continue to grow together yes you alluded earlier on at the beginning that um obviously once you've got into your current relationship that there was some I forget exactly how you worded it maybe you could be struggles but quite early on yes so yeah so and so if if you're prepared to share a little bit more info about that and then what it was that tipped the balance what was it that changed the trajectory yeah great question I think you know one it was a the situation where I always wanted to leave just because of arguments and be you know we we got into a relationship really quickly and like it was amazing at first like we dated and it was great and we moved in together really quickly and like we were getting to know one another really well promptly and you know there were situations with like most of it external whether it be like friends or like friends having comments and like us having to get to a point where we were like this is you and I and forget the external things um and I think most of relationships early on it typically is external elements that are kind of infiltrating and I think more than anything the way that we got through it was really having to hash out and communicate and when you communicate you have to communicate sure we went through the phases of communication it's like frustration then we went to you know let's hear one another out and then solving it but we had to go through that and we had to experience it in a real way for us to get to the other side and you know that is how we continue to be we continue to communicate when things are struggling like we're going through struggles you know so I'm thinking because you're right communication is the absolute the crux of well all human interaction sure both literally and in pretty much every every sense possible yep um you mentioned earlier the differing in terms of for example you were saying how you like to just walk away yes now maybe part of that was that was it you just wanted to close the door and not and that was that conversation and but but there's a stage beyond that of which I see many people experience within sort of an intercouple relationship whereby one partner wants to deal with the situation yes so that's me by the way yes I'm the person my brain's active it's like I'm feeling all the feelings I'm not afraid to discuss them I'm not afraid to explore it I want to resolve I want to I'm like a problem solver so I would be running away from you exactly yeah exactly and of course if if you and I were in a relationship like that I would be getting frustrated because you're running away you're getting frustrated because I'm chasing exactly and we're literally you know at loggerheads so how do we how do you help people compromise in that situation oh you're right yeah that that is the the realest relationship struggle in the world it's nine times out of ten you're not going to be with someone that is like you and if you are you are not going to be able to for me this is what I you may have you know significant similarities you may have values in common but like true personality types no you're not going to be the same which is not even an interesting relationship for me so I would say that when you have that a lot of people want to run from that because they think this is not how a relationship is supposed to be and that's not true the truth is is that a real quality relationship is supposed to pressure not pressure but it's supposed to kind of elevate you beyond what you're accustomed to doing right so like in your case or even in my husband's case he had to get to a point where he had to understand that although like I may sit here and have a conversation with you about this I really don't a want to and b and b and b when I'm having when I'm having this conversation you have to understand especially earlier on that the things that I say and typically I'm very very adamant about you know conscious being consciously aware of what the words that I speak and all of those things but sometimes in those moments the words that I say may not be very what you really want to hear and the way that you want to hear it so you're going to have to compromise and have a better understanding of that right same with me is okay I have to compromise and sit here although I don't want to and really learn how to express myself better in this place where I don't want to be so that we can get to a resolution so it really is like everyone is coming together with a better understanding of who they are and who the other person is and that it may not be immediately a fruitful situation like in year one year two year three but please believe if you continue to invest in that mode of whatever you're in that's uncomfortable it's going to be worthwhile in the end yes so I want to I want to question you on something because yes I've actually I've just recorded a podcast episode that hasn't actually come out yet but it will have aired by the time that this episode perfect timing um yes and I'm talking about compromise and because I think as you describe it and I think many people see it the same way when you're in any kind of difference between people you have one person who is right and one person who is wrong let's be clear let's say let's say clarify but either way it doesn't really matter the point is that you're at like polar opposites in terms of where you are and for anybody who can't see my hand which is everybody by the way I have one right up at the top of the screen and one at the bottom so what one be you know one person is essentially like at a hundred let's say and the other person's at zero and then the the logic is that that compromise makes sense meet in the middle middle ground all these kinds of this terminology this language but then what that does that brings one person up and it brings the other person down and they both meet at this you know hypothetical 50 50. The problem is I mean I'd like your take on this but yeah this is what I discussed but the problem is that 50 at 50 is still 100 so it's actually a zero-sum game you've made no forward progress by compromise plus it also means that if because to compromise almost by definition is for basically so in the dynamic that you and I were talking about just a moment ago it's a little bit like saying I'm going to have to be in a little bit of pain yeah to remain in this relationship and you're going to have to be in a little bit of pain to remain in this relationship and that's ultimately what compromise looks like to me now I believe that that's not necessary I believe there's there's ways in which we can utilise the strengths the opinions the ideas the feelings and the thinking of both parties to work together I agree aim above 100 so I agree yeah I'd just be interested to to know what you're taking compromises when I yeah when I describe it that way I love that description and I think that you know the the thing that resonated with me the most is a the balance piece right and then the piece that when you meet in the middle like both it's actually not really like what you truly it's not really meeting in the middle I mean it's it's a it's a it's a great first step sure sure it's like I'm not saying it's not I'm not saying you shouldn't compromise you've made progress right but I think and what really resonated with me was the piece about you know I'm going to be in pain and you're going to be in pain and and that to me is not that's not the the desire of anyone right to be in pain for any situation I think that compromise for me is ensuring having an understanding that your needs are not always going to be the priority and and I think that that like I'm all about self-care and ensuring that like you are you know like the focus and like you have to ensure that you're good before you can offer anything to anyone else right that's very powerful and true but at the end of the day relationships kind of encourage us to make sure that we can care and connect with someone else outside of all of our needs right and I think compromise is a key element and and you not sacrificing you but knowing that like I said having an understanding and knowing that you your barriers are being broken to evolve like and that's really all I think you know I always have this conversation with my friends that you know Logan and I have a lot of things in common we have amazing conversations and like we have a lot of opinions that just do not match up a lot of times right and we have gotten into heated discussions over these opinions and we have been like how did this even like how did this match even occur because of some of these opinions right and the thing is is that when we have clear discussions and we allow ourselves to listen and compromise because that's really what compromise is too is listening over time our opinions have shifted to be more complementary to one another right which is very fascinating to me because very fascinating right like two years ago if you would have told me that I would believe or agree with Logan on certain topics I would be like yeah right but the point is is that you know that compromise and that listening and that communication and the combination of all of that has allowed us to break down our barriers to grow and evolve and become more of who we are really supposed to be right so I think that the pain points should just be more about understanding that this is just growth it's just growth yeah it's growth so when people have the next the next question I've got is regarding after somebody has been to a retreat yeah it's a bit like uh I suppose it's in some respects not does I mean how long are these typically five to seven days right okay yeah so very intense but I suppose on the grand scheme of things relatively short period yeah super fun well yeah they sound amazing yeah I mean I'm not doubting that at all what I'm interested in particularly because you'd already spoken about data and something you're really interested yeah I know I know for a fact that you will track the progress of people beyond their stuff oh for sure for sure so talk to me about that yeah so so once someone goes on a retreat like first of all they have the option to reconnect with us and we always follow up I do one-on-ones and then we have additional resources that we provide and all of that but as far as like relationship status typically and this is data analysis too seven out of ten people that go on retreats feel that they are now able to more be more talkative they feel more connected all of those things and the majority of the reviews I would probably say eight out of ten of the reviews feel like our retreaters say that that is exactly what occurred and they feel more confident in their communication they feel more connected to one another and they feel like their relationship has taken you know a step up there have been reality checks on these couples retreats for people and in some instances a couple of relationships have ended and I think that's obviously not the goal but my goal is always to ensure that people are doing what's best for them and I think you know just once again allowing them to be in a space where they can't have a solid realisation and feel comfortable in that and a lot of times those individuals that do decide to no longer be in relationship they both walk away feeling comfortable versus being frustrated about it so the first thing that I work with my clients with it's given you know most people approach me any point from a few days after they've read a text message on somebody's on their partner's phone to in some cases a couple of decades or more it would really extend but they the first thing that we really focus on is getting clear on what they actually want yes of whether they even want to be in this relationship yes because often it's the memory or the the this this imagined identity of what I looked like in that relationship that I'm trying to get back to people always say I just want things to go back to the way they were but then when we start unpeeling that it's like no I really don't want to go that's definitely not what I want because I now see all of the bits that weren't right or the the bits that I could have done something different and this doesn't matter whether you on which side of the the betrayal fence you fall it applies to to both partners and and I think I can totally understand how how that would be true in your situation as well where people sometimes go they are in that environment they really do start to get an understanding of each other but also a better understanding of themselves and then it's like hang on naturally this person isn't the it's not so and that's why I think it's good to go like on vacations or retreats or whatever it may be with other couples and especially other couples in different phases of the relationship whether it's early they've been together for 20 years 15 years whatever and you may lie at the five-year mark or whatever it may be but not necessarily comparing but just seeing and remembering either I remember when we used to be like this and we can like be more fun so let's invest in being more fun or we should be this way more or whatever it may be and I think just being able to kind of relate to different phases and different types of relationships is very fruitful for people and I think that it is like I said a reality check like they look so happy we are not you know so it's like either can we get there or nope we're not gonna get there ever again and that is like I like you said that is okay like it's okay if I just always feel that people should make the effort if they are comfortable with doing so and making that effort really makes a difference too for you to walk away or whatever it may be and I think for I mean I'll be interested what's the what sort of age range oh man it's it's it spans a gamut I would say anywhere from like 28 to about 55 yeah okay okay yeah so it's not that dissimilar mine's probably a little bit I'm probably seeing people more late 30s to mid-50s is that sort of window I'd say and I'm thinking from like the perspective of of myself you know when I was in my 20s if there's these like unwritten societal expectations I know you know you know find a partner I know we'd have kids buy a house do all the things right and then you get and you get to the point where you've got all of those things and you know you you don't feel fulfilled in the way exactly you're still like okay what's next what's next yeah exactly yeah and you get to use of your 40s and then maybe your 50s and it's like and you're either in that same relationship or maybe you've moved on to a different relationship and it's like there's no there's no instructions for now right like what is going on so it's like on the one hand I'm like I'm I'm frustrated that I've sort of complied with this societal expectation however at least I knew what to do now it's like now what now I don't know what to do seriously well and that's why it's so good like I love relationships like honestly because you know I'm data analysis and the 14 percent of people are unhappy this is American data by the way yeah but um at the end of the day like quality relationships really do have the finesse and the ability to make not make you but they help you to be happier right and I think that just knowing how to invest in relationships and the correct types of relationships and ensuring that what you're doing and while you're investing is like fun and enjoyable because all of the external stuff is it can't last you know it's not going to last I'm like we had a reality check and a health scare recently and um that really forced me to be like that all I care about like in the grand scheme of thing like being in the hospital it's like I didn't care about work I didn't care about what I wanted to eat because I didn't eat I didn't care about how I looked all I care about was my partner yeah you know and I think there's so much value in having those types of relationships whether it's friendships or colleagues or you know your your lover whomever just knowing that that person is going to be there and vice versa and investing in the correct relationship and if you don't want to be in a relationship anymore like let it go because I always tell people if I don't want to be there if you're sick and you don't want to be there if I'm sick then this ain't gonna work you know what I mean yeah absolutely hospitals are fun and fascinating I was actually in hospital myself quite seriously for about five weeks uh 18 18 months ago and one of the things that I was reminded of I was on several wards and I met lots of people who were in the hospital at the same time from every background imaginable you know it's such uh you know of course nobody wants to be in hospital whereas usually the reasons aren't usually positive positive um but it's such a leveller it's such a I suppose a reality check in a lot of ways that actually all of a sudden all of these superficial things that we've been chasing yes all of these things that we think will make us happy yes they just don't matter anymore yes because really all that does matter is relationships yes it's that connection between you and a human being yes it is so true and it's just a resounding like powerful thing to be a part of and it's frustrating that you have to go through crazy things in the world to get to that place or to be reminded but it is a level playing field when it comes to health and life and death it just is and and you're absolutely right like the relationships are invaluable like the love and the connection is just that's it that is it well that's a beautiful place to draw at your close to me so thank you ever so much again for being here today sharing your wonderful knowledge and experience so for our listeners how can people get hold of you what to tell me all the things of course i'll include i'll include everything in the show notes as well of course perfect yes of course thank you for having me for starters this was a wonderful conversation i want to come back no i'm kidding but yes i love it give me one of these retreats i'm sure we can work something out seriously absolutely but yes everyone can reach out to me couples experience.com and then my instagram tamika underscore carlton jbp and yeah looking forward to it i do one-on-one coaching retreats all of the things relationship based and would love to chat perfect absolutely amazing thank you ever so much thank you you too well i hope that you found that conversation with me and tamika as useful and as entertaining as i did i think the important takeaway for me is that when you're going through a difficult period within your relationship you can often feel so isolated it can feel like there's no hope that there's no way to make that step forward to try and rebuild that connection or maybe even to have success in a future relationship but like with the couples retreats that tamika has been speaking about today this is one of so many ways in which you can rebuild connection with your partner one of so many ways that you can start to reignite that thing that perhaps has faded in your relationship but remember that hope will only get you so far it still requires intention it still requires you to do things on purpose to help rebuild those connections and to really try and strengthen that relationship to a level that perhaps maybe you didn't even realise i'd really like to thank you once again for listening and i can't wait to speak to you again next week take care.